I’ve been working on a module based on this, seeing how this is going in a similar direction, I thought I would drop my results in the conversation. It includes two algorhtims for automatic curves, for whatever they are worth. Feel free to get inspiration from it.
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Had a chance to play with this today using this image. I think the module is brilliant!
- My previous method for achieving local contrast, using a custom ‘diffuse or sharpen’ preset, with tone eq:
its-your-round-25-05-06_MG_5848_03.CR2.xmp (21.9 KB)
- Using the three scale ‘local contrast rgb’ by @Wilecoyote, with tone eq:
its-your-round-25-05-06_MG_5848_06.CR2.xmp (26.7 KB)
- Using the current ‘contrast & texture’, with tone eq:
its-your-round-25-05-06_MG_5848_04.CR2.xmp (22.6 KB)
- As per 3, with slightly different settings, and using the shadows and highlights sliders instead of tone eq:
its-your-round-25-05-06_MG_5848_05.CR2.xmp (30.7 KB)
I could not properly control the halos at the top of the building and power lines:
However that problem existed for all modules, and was just made more obvious with the last settings.
Considering only contrast, not sky recovery, my favourite result came from 2, which I was able to achieve quickly, however 3 gave a similar result, and perhaps could have been done just as quickly had I been more familiar with it. Either way it is a fantastic module, improving on what I was able to achieve previously.
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@jandren, you wanted some examples with images to show a situation where I might want multiple base detail levels for each slider. So here is a series that illustrates what I mean:
Original scene with basic edits
This is a very busy scene, so I want to calm down some of the “chaos”. Much of this chaos is in the medium details - the branches, twigs and leaves. So I reduce the medium detail contrast, finding the exact base detail level I want. This is not an exact science, but I found this detail level of about 2 to target the chaos:
Resulting softening of image:
This has calmed down the details, but I’ve lost some of the overall contrast and depth to the image. So I can bring this back with coarse details. To avoid bringing back the chaotic details, I want a very coarse detail level, so I can bring the base detail level slider way down until we’re just working on very broad areas:
When I increase the contrast in these coarse areas, I bring back some depth to the image:
Finally, I want to bring out some of the finer details without bringing back the chaotic medium details. So I want to use a higher base detail level and the fine details slider. This is very hard to see zoomed out, so here I’ve zoomed in to 100% so you can see the fine detail level:
Resulting image:
I find this has a better balance of details, so we have sharpness where it counts and overall depth, but without sharp, crunchy details everywhere. In this case, to achieve it, I used the following base detail levels:
Coarse = 1.18
Medium = 2.11
Fine = 7.00
And the only way to achieve this was to use 3 instances.
If the base detail level could be adjusted per contrast slider, I could have done it in one instance.
I realize this will make the module busier, but multiple instances just makes the pixelpipe busier and is clunkier to work with.
(Also, this post is just for illustrative purposes. I don’t claim that this is a fantastic edit or that there aren’t other ways to achieve this kind of edit.)
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Thank you for the great example!
Will be an interesting challenge to see what kind of design change could cover that need.
@Soupy yeah halos in such situations seems to be challenging for the eigf filter, it looks more and more likely that I have to take a closer look at the filter itself.
@huge_raw_tinkerer oooh fun! Would you mind explaining the main things you did and the thinking behind it? I will try it out but unfortunately have a week with little extra time for darktable atm.
No worries @mino i myself prefer a simpler module when possible and its nice to hear not everyone in the community always wants more! About the harshness, yes the band pass approach is much more effective at pulling out details. But i thought it would just be a matter of not pushing the gain as much. Might be relevant to investigate more.
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Hello. Thank you for creating a new interesting module. I am late to the party to look at it, but hoping that I find it useful, I would love to try it.
There’s been a lot of discussion about it already and I feel unsure where to start. Is there a writeup of how to use all the sliders, what do they do? I would rather try with a bit of handholding at first rather than move the sliders randomly hoping to guess what they do.
Thank you very much.
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I use this module in most of my edits now. It’s replaced the “coarse contrast” treatment in contrast equalizer for me, and also I often use it to give midtone details to particular bits in a photograph with masking. I’m also occasionally giving it a go for reducing the dynamic range, but so far I like tone equalizer more for this.
However its workings remain a mistery to me. It’s hard for me to grasp why we need the “base detail level” slider if the controls are split into fine/mid/coarse details later on - and I have found out, that slider affects their function too.
I guess it’s one of those modules I’m to use every day without understanding some of its controls. As is typical for darktable (not a bad thing)
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Jokob, I don’t think the module should add more slides. I think it will ended up too complex and hinder being able to create useful presets.
Currently I have a preset I called portrait. It adds a bit of course and removes some of the fine. I then just use the single base slider to fine tune, if needed. If more sliders are added for each level, then it will mean more fine tuning. I don’t think modules should try to address every edge case scenario.
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+1. Am nearly always creating a second instance of the module on landscape pics for the sky alone.
Can’t overstate how much I love this module though. Is making all my edits better.
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My 2 cents. I also find myself using multiple instances for portraiture. It is rarely the case that I can find a base scale that results in multiple useful scales.
I like the multi-scale approach, but it would be much more useful if I could tune each scale independently.
That said, as I already stated before, this has immediately become my go-to solution for contrast and sharpening, I really love this module.
Also, just thinking out loud. I would really love to be able to select a scale range. The scale control should be like a parametric channel, a range and a tapering area. I have no idea how feasible or really desirable this is, I just have a nagging feeling that it would be great 
EDIT: this would be somewhat halfway between the single-scale control and @huge_raw_tinkerer’s proposal above, which is great BTW.
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Uhhh that sounds like a nice idea. As I wrote above I feel like the effect of Step 1 blended more nicely into the whole scenery while the bandpass effect of Step 2 makes the local contrast more aggressive.
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Would you be willing to share the preset? Maybe others would also like to share some presets here. I find them useful to understand how modules work in more experienced hands.
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I’m not at home. I just took an image and played with it and saved the preset. I used it in other images and tweaked until I was happy with it.
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One thing I like about the Tone Equalizer is that you can choose a different filter, and actually I tend to use the normal “guided filter” (non exposure invariant) about 60% of the time. I find it handles shadows better, and it can also be manipulated to make nice soft transitions that can add a pseudo Orton effect.
Now, I’m not suggesting you add multiple filters, and I certainly don’t want this new module to turn out like the Tone Equalizer (the interface of which I really don’t like), but maybe there are some ideas to be gleaned from it.
I also want to make the point that not all halos are bad. Ugly, sharp and narrow halos are definitely bad, but soft, diffused glows can be nice if used judiciously. So, I personally don’t feel the aim should be to completely eliminate haloing unless it’s just the ugly type.
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Is the point of this module, roughly, that:
a) whereas in contrast equalizer i have 8 (?) nodes from coarsest to finest scale, but it’s a bit difficult to tell which each of the scales is, this module gives me just 3 (because less is more) BUT it lets me define what the coarsest is using the base slider AND gives me a magic way to reduce ugly haloes once I have enough contrast?
b) replaces the shadows and highlights module but with better maths behind the scenes
…or have I misunderstood?
Also, could ‘noise bias’ be changed to a percentage? A number with four decimal places is not the most quickly readable or understood.
Sounds about right. Haven’t focused so much on what it replaces myself but that would kind of be the consequences. It started with a local contrast upgrade to scene-referred editing, the additional slider, but still fever than the contrast equalizer, is a effect from user input and trying to keep it as simple as possible.
Sorry for not giving a hand with the introduction but seems like you managed on your own!
@Soupy maybe, its currently just the actual value which is probably the easiest to explain but it is as you say tiny. My two initial alternatives would be %of middle grey or ev stops under middle grey.
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On my preliminary testing I find I probably get best results using a combination of this new scene referred module and the old displayed referred module. I find multiple modules sharing the load for shadow and highlights often works best in my hands rather than a single sledge hammer approach with one module alone. Pleased to see this new tool.
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I tried the module last night for the first time. I like the overall simplicity, even though, like @Terry and others, I’ve resorted to using more than one instance of the module. For me, that is easier than managing a more-complex module with more sliders.
Thanks for a great module!
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Thanks for reporting!
There are other options than sliders to address workflow issues, interpolation method being a obvious one. So I would be happy to get a example edit where multiple instances are needed for you even though you feel that its ok.
We are also all newbies at using this module, even me, so learning new tricks in its usage might be as powerful as another slider
After now testing the module I would reverse my opinion about creating a separate module for shadow and highlights. It works very well in its current lay out for helping with shadows and highlights recovery, but for me I will also still reach for other modules to work in synergy with the new contrast and texture module. This module adds to my arsenal of tools and doesn’t simply replace any of the current tools for me.
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