Ahh… That makes sense.
I’m trying out file format “JPEG Lossless.” Of course files are large so I need to manage that.
My first run with DNG Converter using this format appears to be a success. The converted file is HUGE (almost 300 MB), but it opens in Darktable and behaves more like a Raw image.
Thanks for the good help with this!
That sounds like a totally uncompressed image to me - 48Mpix * 2Bytes * 3planes (demosaiced) = 288MB. I was expecting JPEG lossless to reduce this by 30-40% typically…
Thanks again.
I’ve been testing different options in DNG Converter. It appears to be necessary to Embed the Original Raw File. But I’ve got file size down to a more manageable 68 MB. I can live with that.
I’ve tried again with a few more images. To me, these converted DNG’s look like darkened JPEG’s, with little useful dynamic range for tone and color tuning.
It’s disappointing. I think I’ll take a look at a 3rd party camera app like halide or ProCamera. I understand that resolution for true RAW capture is limited by Apple to 12 MB, but having flexibility to adjust tone and color is important to me.
Thanks again for the good help here.
Hello Doug! My experience with Apple ProRAW is about the same. The RAW files from Apple do not have the bit depth or dynamic range for heavy shadow recovery etc. that you would expect from a RAW file. The main advantage I saw is the less strong optimization (sharpening, contrast) done by Apple. This can be an advantage for portraits.
I‘m sure there is a reason why phone manufacturers don‘t want to show the real raw data coming from their sensors. Once I took „real raw data“ with CHDK hack software from an old Canon D10 that normally also doesn‘t want to make you see it. It had a 12 mp sensor and the raw data hat 40.000 dead pixels, the image looked weird without lens correction! It took a lot of work to get only near the JPG that Canon created out of that very raw data.
So phone manufacturers probably always give you just kind of a pseudo-RAW with less heavy optimization applied.
Thank you, Roland.
FYI if you happen to like Apple’s tone mapping (at least as a starting point for light editing), the method I outlined above* will get you there directly. It uses a smaller file than JPEG Lossless (~19 Mb vs ~66 Mb), and requires no third-party software converter.
Bright sections of the photo are toned down, and dark sections up. But it doesn’t look like a classic S-curve, maybe due to the algo, which I think uses several images.
https://research.adobe.com/articles/indigo/indigo.html
You could see what sort of images you get from this new app if your iphone is on the supported list??
Hi Todd,
Thank you. I tried this app (Project Indigo - it’s free!) and Darktable does not recognize the contents of the DNG image containers. 
I’ve just started a trial with Halide. Using “Process Zero” mode, raw DNG’s import directly into Darktable.
Images are indeed limited to 12 MP, but that’s probably best for total image quality (no HDR processing, multiple exposures etc.). To me images look more like those from an SLR.
This is a known problem I already reported to Adobe, hope they fix it in some future version:
In the meantime setting the DefaultCropSize tag manually using e.g exiftool (or simply removing it) should work.
Thanks for sharing…I don’t have an iPhone so I couldn’t test it out…
That’s what I use, and it is working out very well. So well that I don’t really mind paying for it.
Thank you, Tim.
So far, here is what I’ve learned.
Halide supports both Raw and Apple ProRAW. Raw resolution is 12 MP and ProRaw either 12 or 48 MP. The DNG wrapper for Halide’s ProRaw seems different than what I get with the standard photos app. The “.jxl trick” does not work, but both Raw and ProRaw DNG’s open in RawTherapee. These files appear similar except that ProRaw has much less noise (and can have higher resolution). Tone, brightness, and black point are not identical but look surprisingly similar.
The Raw files open in Darktable, but the ProRaw DNG’s are incompatible. I much prefer Darktable, even as a novice. RawTherapee has a great-looking interface, but I’m confused about many of the controls.
Interestingly, the two DNG’s look quite different in the Apple Photos app (Raw can have blown highlights in sunny scenes, but ProRaw has that HDR-look), but the files look very similar in RawTherapee. Hmm.
It seems there is little point in shooting ProRaw in Halide except for convenience. It looks like Apple’s ProRaw process flow takes priority over manual settings in Halide.
Shooting in Raw requires much more attention to exposure than ProRaw or standard JPEG/HEIF. It’s much easier to over or under-expose images with Raw. More like shooting with a DSLR. “Manual mode” is more like Aperture-Priority, but with a single aperture setting.
In low-light conditions I am seeing considerable noise shooting RAW. Perhaps there is a better way to manage exposure. Apple’s multi-step process does a much better job reducing noise. But the photographer seems to lack control.
That’s it for Day 1 with Halide. 
Interesting. My usual trouble with Halide raw is overexposure, not underexposure.
Also, since Halide claims that their Raw Zero is giving you the actual raw data, not massaged by Apple’s algorithms, I wonder whether the 12 MP is the actual native resolution and Apple is upscaling it to that 48 MP? I’ll try to investigate, further.
Thanks for all that info.
PS - Here’s an article that explains all of what you said, clearly. There are reasons that Halide provides only 12 MP, and they are explained in the article.
https://www.dpreview.com/news/5101705770/halide-process-zero-ai-computational-photograpy-phones-raw
Ouch! I just learned something else, something that seems counterintuitive: A Halide Process Zero photo is not Process Zero unless you save it as HEIC or JPG. If you save it as DNG, you are getting something else. This completely overturns my understanding about everything I have been trying to do. I, too, am now about ready to give up on Halide.
I assume that the 48mpix is binned down to 12mpix.
Ok, by digging, I have discovered that my iPhone (a 13 Pro Max) does support Apple Pro Raw but does not support the higher resolutions. It appears to have 12 MP, only. 
“On iPhone 14 Pro and later Pro models, you can capture Apple ProRAW images at two resolutions: 12 megapixels or 48 megapixels.”
It’s almost time for my birthday. Maybe I’ll splurge for an OM System camera. I currently have a Nikon D-3300, and I have access to my son’s D-750. But, my word, they are big and clunky to carry around. 
Here’s a good explanation of what ProRAW actually is:
Basically it’s the same demosaiced and computationally massaged data as in a HEIC or JPEG file, but without tone mapping applied (so it’s linear) and higher bit-depth.
The sensor is 48 MP binned down to 12 MP for image quality reasons. I believe the main benefit is improved noise performance.
Hi Tim,
I think that article on Process Zero is a bit confusing. According to Halide, Process Zero records a Beyer Raw file (DNG) and optionally a processed HEIC for easy sharing.
I have no cause to doubt the developers at Lux, but these DNG images are quite different from what I get with my old Canon Rebel XT (please don’t shame me, it was a gift!). Perhaps it’s just a limitation of the sensor, but it seems there is less dynamic range on these Halide images, and I find it harder to tune than the CR2’s from the Canon. Maybe it’s just me, though.
I’d love one of those compact OM micro 4/3 cameras. Some day…
I looked at the OM-5 II, today. $1,199 plus lenses. Prime, fast lenses are $500 and up. It looks great, but it is beyond what I want to spend. Everything is so expensive, these days.
Yikes! You could save a little with a budget model like this:
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1576155-REG/olympus_v207130su000_om_d_e_m10_mark_iv.html
Some 4/3 camera bodies are as large as full-frame cameras, so take care.
Lumix is another popular brand…