Need help softproofing in RT

Software RawTherapee
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I have read the rawpedia entry at the bottom of this page:
http://rawpedia.rawtherapee.com/The_Image_Editor_Tab
But I’m still in doubt as there are two places two chose profiles.

  1. in the Preferences menu, color management Tab
  2. Drop-down list below the image editor

To my understanding RT needs to know both profiles, the calibration profile of my monitor and the softproofing profile of my printing shop. So where do I choose which?
Thanks
Stephan

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@McCap Preferences > Color Management

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That is where you set the folder where ICC files are to be found (monitor profile ICC and soft-proofing/output ICC), and which one of them should be the default monitor profile.

Under the preview

This is where you select the actual monitor profile (it can be but does not have to be the default one).
You can also enable soft-proofing.

If you enabled soft-proofing, the output profile from the Color Management tool is used:

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@Morgan_Hardwood, thank you very much!!
I was blind and had overlooked the color management tool totally. :confounded:

Now it all makes sense. :slight_smile:

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I also updated RawPedia:
http://rawpedia.rawtherapee.com/The_Image_Editor_Tab#Monitor_Profile_and_Soft-Proofing

1 Like
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@Morgan_Hardwood, good to see you back after your trip!

Great, that you updated RawPedia. The previous description of the feature also left me clueless in that respect. I still have one question: If I export the raw now with the e.g. “JapanColor2002Newspaper” profile used for soft-proofing, this will be the one embedded in the exported JPEG, doesn’t it? So after soft-proofing and before export I’ll have to remember to switch it back to sRGB, as that is, what my print service expects. Isn’t it a bit dangerous to share the soft-proofing profile with the output profile?

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@floessie hey :slight_smile:
You may very well be correct… but I will take a while to think about it first. It could be that it is the way it is because we decided it’s better to have some form of soft-proofing than none in 5.0… I don’t remember for sure. We could ask @Hombre and/or check the soft-proofing issues:
Softproofing branch · Issue #3406 · Beep6581/RawTherapee · GitHub
https://github.com/Beep6581/RawTherapee/issues/3029

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It’s around here…

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Thanks for the update. But for the great unwashed (me), what the hell is RawTherapee 5?

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The next stable version, once 4 is worked out, reworked and considered fully stabilized. (I’m guessing, but that makes sense to me.)

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Yes, it’s a bit unfinished actually. As @Morgan_Hardwood said, decision has been took to make something usable for the coming Release version, that extra “SoftProof” profile button would be added later, all in a dedicated “Color Management” tab next to the History, to free up some space in the bottom toolbar.

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@Morgan_Hardwood

I started using RT many versions ago and since then I have always entered my (custom) monitor profile as the default profile in the Preferences>Color Management dialog. Once done I assumed that profle was always applied to the Preview image, without the need for selecting it with the (later added) widget in the main preview toolbar. Now that I have loaded RT-4.2.1375 I become aware of the softproofing function and other improvements as described in your edit of the RawPedia. Many thanks. If I activate soft proofing the output profile (specified in the Color Management tool) is applied to the Preview image. May I assume the default monitor profile is applied “on top of” the output profile?

Previously I have been using RT-4.2.1291. With 4.2.1375, I note that the option “Use working profile for main histogram and Navigator” (Preferences>General) is no longer offered. What do I need to know about this subject?

With reference to floessie’s post above: I assume he is correct. My customary workflow is as follows:

  1. Open raw image. Use ProPhoto as working profile. Apply editing tools as needed and save image as a 16 bit tiff master copy (using ProPhoto as output profile).

  2. Load master copy. Leave ProPhoto as working profile (What effect, if any, does this have on subsequent steps?) Change output profile (color management tool) to that supplied by my online printer (Costco) and enable softproofing. Edit the image as needed. Adjust sharpening based on the print size to be ordered. Save this “print ready” file as a jpeg, leaving it in the soft proof (output) profile. Costco assures me this is acceptable (even preferable) as long as the profile is properly embedded in the file. Depending on the requirements of your printer, an alternate approach, as described by floessie, may be needed.

Any suggestions gladly appreciated.

1 Like
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It should be, though @Hombre is the guy to ask as he implemented it.

That’s not correct, the option is still there.

I must go, I can’t answer the rest now…

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@Morgan_Hardwood

That’s not correct, the option is still there.

I am scheduled to pick up my new eyeglasses today. Thanks.

Now that I have found it, must ask: If this option is left unchecked, what profile is used for main histogram and Navigator? (output profile?)

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You can see here how the Color Management works at the end of the pipeline : https://github.com/Beep6581/RawTherapee/blob/master/tools/color_management.svg - you can “Save as…” the image to see it better, or use your browser’s “Display image” contextual menu entry

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Ok so, if my print shop ask me explicitly not to embed their Icc in the output file, what I do is:

  1. Set output to some sRGB (that is what they want).
  2. Set Monitor to the profile of the print shop. (RT will then put the monitor calibration on top of that)

At least this is what I got from this discussion so far…

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No, the intended process in the Editor panel with the actual behavior (unfinished, I know, but we have only two hands and spare time) is :

  1. to set the the monitor profile to your monitor profile (this will never change unless your moving the editor to a secondary monitor),
  2. set the output profile to your print shop’s profile,
  3. enable soft-proofing (don’t forget the gamut check feature)
  4. adjust your image for printing to your liking
  5. switch back output profile to sRGB (with embedded sRGB profile, no the “NoICM” entry) ; maybe AdobeRGB is better, or another image output profile, I won’t enter in this debate
  6. process your image

5 and 6 can easily be done all file at once in the File Browser, but fine adjustments are done on a per image in the Editor, of course.

4 Likes
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[2016-12-03 edit]
One more note : there is 2 “Black Point Compensation” checkbox in RT : one in Preferences for the Monitor profile, one in the ICM panel for the output image (and then reflected in soft-proofing).

Be aware that when in soft-proofing mode, the checkbox activating the BPC feature is the one from the ICM panel, the monitor BPC checkbox will be ignored, but that may change in the future.

There is not strike through feature for comments, so I’m putting the old version of this comment as quotes for reference…

1 Like
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By…

I assume you mean to export your results? (That is - you are not meaning to adjust the image further)?

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Yes. But as @mikesan said, depending on the intended use of your image, you could save 2 versions of your image. This could be made easier if RT had multi-processing param support for each file.

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As a better answer : you could of course make further adjustment to you image once you set back the sRGB output profile, but in this case you’d probably want to adjust the printing version again as a final step (at least that’s what I would do).