Is development really important?

[prokoudine (Alex Prokoudine)]

@Eigil_Skovgaard

I’m only technically a moderator (never asked for the privilegies, never used them), but as this showed up in my inbox, I had to review the thread in question.

What I think we have here is a mix of two issues ­— a cultural clash and an attempt to push Pixls towards Reddit-like discussions. We can have a sensible conversation about the former, but I don’t think anyone here would appreciate the latter.

So if you disagree with the culture where volunteers are entitled to calling the shots on design decisions and if you gravitate towards aggressive conversations, you will find Pixls an inferior platform to talk to people. Fortunately, there’s an abundance of platforms where you might feel right at home.

[martin.scharnke]

Hello Eigil,

Thank you for your memorandum … I do not follow the RT threads, so I was not aware of you until you posted in the lounge.

Having read the two threads in question as well as this one, I do need to agree with the general sentiment expressed by others here … that pixls.us is largely supportive, courteous, and, above all, community. A community, by its very definition is concerned with the well-being of all its inhabitants.

One of the characteristics of community is that we do not always agree with one another on everything. We can misunderstand, or have genuinely conflicting points-of-view. What makes community special, however, is that individual disagreements never prevent the ongoing community. I am a Lutheran Pastor here in Australia, and I have just this week been preaching on a verse from Saint Paul (Ephesians 4:32) which may be summarised as: Be kind to each other, compassionate, and forgiving, remembering that you, too, have been forgiven.

Really, that is all that the moderators and the “rules” of our community are asking. When I do the wrong thing on this forum (and I have, in the past), and that is pointed out to me, I will strive not to repeat it. Where there is misunderstanding, let us seek to express with clarity what we are trying to communicate. Remember also that for many here, English is not their first language. Moreover, some part of society (and me at least on this forum) are on the Autism Spectrum, and do not read “between the lines” very well, if at all.

Though you could take @prokoudine’s suggestion and search elsewhere for discussion, suggestions and feature-requests are never a bad idea. Just remember the reasons already given why the implementation of these may not always happen.

We would be poorer as a community if there were not a wide variety of opinions: every member has a different set of go-to software. Some developers on github and here would possibly like to “compete” against commercial software, but I cannot say who they might be. However I can say that developers in our community are willing to listen and to respond. Though their response may not always fit in with your preferences, you are certainly free to change to different software that meets your needs.

So, please keep expressing your thoughts and opinions and feature requests. Please be kind. Please forgive the offences you feel from members of our community, and please graciously consider how you might help make our community better than it already is.

[gaaned92]

This guy comes from nowhere, feels superior and entitled, is rude and blunt, always write in a negative manner. I suspect he is a trolling teen-ager.
I hope post of @martin.scharnke will change his mind.

[Eigil_Skovgaard]

@spidermonkey

Thanks for your opinion. It is definitely not my job to moderate this forum but I hope it is OK to write this here because it might help to have an opinion from somebody who is not a moderator.

Well, you were the one who called yourself a moderator - Can that title mean anything else than - moderator? - i.e. an experienced sane individual who will moderate in cases where things get fucked up for real. The only examples of corruption and derailing are from your hand.
Of course that comment where you claimed to possess such extraordinary skills disappeared within a minute - very appropriate. Was it manipulative or just wishful thinking?
I was banned twice for calling you “names”, though it’s an interesting fact that the cause will last for the rest of your life.

And to those claiming to have contacted me in private. I have not received such messages if we are talking writing to my private mail address. Then you would have had my answers for sure.

And I can see that the official written goal for developing alternative free source has just been found, dusted off and repeated. What else can you say - not much.

I am pleased to say that my opinions stated in my memorandum above are shared with other seriously working photographers. You can’t ask for more.

Now back to Adobe Camera Raw.

[Thanatomanic (Roel)]

@Eigil_Skovgaard

And to those claiming to have contacted me in private. I have not received such messages if we are talking writing to my private mail address. Then you would have had my answers for sure.

I did get your answer.

[Eigil_Skovgaard]

Roel,

So, you call that private mails, when it’s still a thread in this forum. Nice. I see.
For the sake of my integrity I would never regard messages from you to be private or sincere.
I simply don’t trust you!
And for that reason I expected everything you wrote to be a public matter. And it finally became.
I can’t use your false kindness and moderation.
That’s why I raised (raise) my index finger - symbolic of course.

@martin.scharnke

Thank you for your memorandum …

You are welcome.

And I don’t share your religion. Please don’t include me in your flock.

[Peter]

Ödmjukhet är en dygd. Tycker du verkligen dina kommentarer är okej?

[Eigil_Skovgaard]

Sæt dig ind i årsag og virkning, Peter.

[CarVac]

@Eigil_Skovgaard

So, you call that private mails, when it’s still a thread in this forum.

Private messages look just like normal threads, but they are not readable by others.

In any case, working with open-source software developers is a bit like herding cats. You can’t merely tell them what to do and why it’s better, you have to motivate them, otherwise they will dismiss your suggestion.

Insulting them or their work is counterproductive, so… simply don’t do that.

[Eigil_Skovgaard]

CarVac,

Private conversation with an avatar has nothing to do with privacy or confidence. If you don’t want to reveal your true face, identity etc. you are just another number from the internet.

And btw. you don’t need to explain obvious technical details to me.

If images and explanations are insufficient as motivation - then maybe other considerations are blocking the dialog. The fear of admitting shortcomings in the functionality of your creation for example? - or admitting you are unable to design or code certain features?

is it an insult to point at the advantages of generally accepted functionality not found with the creation at hand?

[gadolf (Gustavo Adolfo)]

@Eigil_Skovgaard

If you don’t want to reveal your true face, identity etc. you are just another number from the internet.

Although I hide myself behind this groking avatar, I’m at your disposal to talk to you face to face, via whatever video meeting platform you may want to use, and try to explain some things that I see you don’t understand.

Just send me your phone number, or anything else that put us face to face. (In a private message, of course).

[Eigil_Skovgaard]

Gadolf,

I don’t need your “private” help. I have the private supporters I need.
You are simply an entity on a forum on the internet - it can’t get more impersonal.
But you could shorten that distance by writing under a picture of yourself and reveal your true name. Why is anonymity the generally accepted way to meet others here?
I would be more confident with your appearance and could get an impression of your personality if I could relate to a well exposed portrait and a real name - and you would probably act more like your true self.

[Thanatomanic (Roel)]

@Eigil_Skovgaard

But you could shorten that distance by writing under a picture of yourself and reveal your true name. Why is anonymity the generally accepted way to meet others here?
I would be more confident with your appearance and could get an impression of your personality if I could relate to a well exposed portrait and a real name - and you would probably act more like your true self.

Sorry, you don’t get to choose how others behave or want to represent themselves. That’s no different in real life than it is on the internet. For all I know you are actually Queen Margrethe. The only thing you need to trust in, is that people want to have civil discourse with each other. For the rest, you can just look at how people behave to judge whether you like them. And well, it seems you’re good at that.

In my case, despite my best intentions and good faith, and continuous attempts to keep a constructive and open dialogue, I seem to have gone over to the dark side from your perspective. Very little I can do to change that, so I’ll be moving on. You probably like that better than my continuous replies anyway

[zerosapte (radu dumitrescu)]

He’s just a troll, stop giving him the attention he so obivously desires.

Ignore him and he’ll hopefully just go away. He doesn’t like it here, anyway.

[Eigil_Skovgaard]

@Thanatomanic

You probably like that better than my continuous replies anyway

Absolutely, Roel.
But can I trust that you will stay out of my sight and never bother me again with yourself-righteous style?
Hardly - your word is not really solid.
But just before you leave: If I am the queen of Denmark to you, then my guess for an alter ego for you would be Joe Biden. Another man without a clue.

[darix]

Enough is Enough. User is silenced for 2 months.

[CarVac]

@Eigil_Skovgaard

Private conversation with an avatar has nothing to do with privacy or confidence. If you don’t want to reveal your true face, identity etc. you are just another number from the internet.

If you’d like to engage in honest in-person discussion about these, I suggest you attend a Libre Graphics Meetup conference when (if?) certain global issues become less problematic.

@Eigil_Skovgaard

If images and explanations are insufficient as motivation - then maybe other considerations are blocking the dialog.

It’s more an aspect of “how does this help my own workflow?” The devs are quite possibly the people getting the most out of the way their own program works—who are you to say that x result is better?

Personal tastes and expectations play a role too. darktable devs might prefer darktable’s output to Filmulator’s, and I certainly prefer Filmulator’s output to darktable’s. Same thing will be true comparing Lightroom to darktable or anything else.

[priort (Todd Prior)]

I am really sorry but this person is clearly a troll or has NPD.

Despite several well meaning attempts to get anything resembling empathy or consensus he just continues to sling away…

What are narcissistic traits (characteristics)?

Healthcare providers diagnose NPD when you have at least five of the following characteristics:

• Overinflated sense of self-importance.
• Constant thoughts about being more successful, powerful, smart, loved or attractive than others.
• Feelings of superiority and desire to only associate with high-status people.
• Need for excessive admiration.
• Sense of entitlement.
• Willingness to take advantage of others to achieve goals.
• Lack of understanding and consideration for other people’s feelings and needs.
• Arrogant or snobby behaviors and attitudes.

I am seriously impressed with all the efforts to understand and engage this individual. In the end there is absolutely no excuse to behave that way and only on social media would someone behave this way…

[paperdigits (Mica)]

Wow…

@Eigil_Skovgaard

I feel like a child molester!

???

@Eigil_Skovgaard

And I need to warn other serious candidates: Within half a year your patience will be severely challenged very negatively.

We are supposed to take advice from a child molester?

@Eigil_Skovgaard

I have lately been motivated to return to the flawless Adobe Camera Raw editor

You should always use the tooling that works for you.

@Eigil_Skovgaard

This forum is dominated by socially isolated types begging for action in their lives.

@Eigil_Skovgaard

typically for such characters they hide behind an avatar.

So we are either hiding in the shadows or you know us well enough to peg us as “social isolated types.” You have to pick one or the other.

@Eigil_Skovgaard

a number of so-called moderators work accordingly to the latest new woke principles by zealously collecting “micro insults”

You mean I know how to use the quote button in the forum. These are all things you’ve said.

@Eigil_Skovgaard

He’s poisonous to the very idea of free speech

So everyone is clear, this forum is absolutely not a free speech zone, and it never was. If you’d read any of our ToS or FAQ, it would be clear that this isn’t a free speech zone.

@Eigil_Skovgaard

Why this hostility to new ideas? Why can’t we talk about changes as normal people without being interrupted by fools?

If you re-read the threads, the only hostility is coming from you, and it still is.

In fact, your straight line brush has been implemented in ART, so things work: when the idea is good enough and there is motivation from a developer, the feature is implemented.

@Eigil_Skovgaard

but the described agenda has already been confirmed by the actual behavior of the so-called moderators, and such a behavior - to a normal person - very much looks like a deliberate suppressive policy protecting an accepted arrested development, a policy which could! be paying off behind the scenes.

I would like to be on public record to state that if someone or something is paying people not to do things, I would like to be a part of that. Please contact me to pay me to do nothing.

Lastly, mental health is a serious thing, and if you need help in Denmark, please seek it out: https://www.psykiatri-regionh.dk/english/Sider/default.aspx