Raw black/white point module - Do I have a problem?

My raw files from Ricoh GR3 are 14bit (DNG).
Raw black/white point module displays 4095 for White for these.
I understand, darktable defaults to 12bit.
Is this the expected behavior? (Not reading/unable to read from the file itself).
Am I required to enter the white point info (I understand to be >16000 for a proper image file) myself?
A related question:
Do you think having this module at the start of a default style is advisable (within the light of current discussions about linear RGB workflow)?

I just tested the sample from raw.pixls.us and the white point is 16,314 in darktable.

Hm, I don’t think so.

You can’t turn this module of. It is mandatory and has not much to do with a linear workflow.

Values are camera specific and just clip every value below and above the given thresholds away, because they are just garbage. If the values are wrong within the black/white point module than it is some sort of bug.

Here is the screenshot for one of the images:

I have just noticed it is among the mandatory modules (actually the first; how I missed that!).
For another image the values were “normal” (64/64/64 for blacks and 16312 for the white).
Perhaps the files I mentioned have something wrong. I’ll have a look.


Strange! I have a folder full of consecutive images shot at the same day at the same place within about the same hour. Some have White points up around 16000, some 4095. Should I be worried?

There are cams which save 12bit raws at hight burst rate while using 14bit at low burst rate. Could that be the case for your cam?

yes, there is something wrong?

No I’m wrong it is because the values are directly taken from the DNG. For my K-3 II white point differs from image to image.

Manual says it has 14 bit RAW only. White is read from the DNG and it differs from image to image on my Pentax. I don’t know why, but it is all good.

No. I have never used the burst mode (intentionally).

This is from the manual, which has to be read first, I know : ( .

This module is activated automatically for raw images and makes sure that the camera specific black and white points are taken into account. Default settings are applied for all supported cameras. Changes to the defaults are normally not required.

I guess it is more likely that some of my files are faulty for some reason.

For both of my Pentax cameras (K-5 and K-3) where I use DNG the white point values differ from image to image. So the values are definitely read from the file.

Maybe the GR III has some nifty features we don’t know?

Hi! Has this been sorted out for you? I just noticed today thay bunch of my pics done recently are washed out of colours in Darktable when I switch from lighttable to darktable module. I loose nice pic and get dark, gloomy one. First time to see that! It is so frustrating

A raw file needs some processing to give a visible image. If you do only the absolute minimum, you’ll end up with an image in scene-referred color space, (i.e. pixel values are linear with light intensity). Such images will look too dark and flat/washed out.

Have a look at the history tab (darkroom mode, left of the image) and check if either filmic or basecurve are active. If neither is present, that’s the cause of the dark pictures.

You still get a nice picture in lighttable mode, as dt uses the jpeg embedded in the raw there. (It’s a bit more complicated in practice , but that should be explained in the manual)


I will look into that, thanks. I use Darktable programme and I found that strange as I was always seeing the initially processed pictures in both views (this nice jpeg view with bright colours) in lighttable and darktable mode. I read that maybe there is a trouble with data set by camera on my new pics connected with “raw black/white point”? To check it I opened some old RAW files that I already worked on and suddenly they got washed out as well even though they were nicely processed by me. I do not recognize that specific tool was used before by DT itself.

First get an idea on a darktable workflow - darktable is not Adobe lightroom.
There’s a wip documentation, but already very useful: https://elstoc.github.io/dtdocs/overview/workflow/
Even for a beginner with darktable i recommend the display-referred workflow. If enabled it gives decent initial results, which can be improved with just a few modules.
quite old but still valid: https://discuss.pixls.us/t/darktable-3-0-for-dummies-in-3-modules

(But this is off topic in this thread)

I am using DT for few years now and that is first time I see the difference between lighttable and darktable modes. It was always setting some changes so the pictures looked fine without any of my further steps. I thought it is connected with some latest releases of DT as it changea even my old pictures which were exported tp jpeg

Can you maybe restate your problem ? I have the feeling people are not getting the issue.
You have old DT processed files (jpeg and raw ) and when you open them with newer versions, the rendering is not the same ?

Thanks Olivier. Yep, I had 3.0.x version on one computer and last month I worked with my raw files which looked same as on camera, in lighttable and darktable modes, I just did some slight changes to raws and got decent jpegs. Yesterday I opened DT 3.2.1, the newest one I believe, with some new raws from last week. I saw nice pics - same as on camera - in lighttable and when I opened them in darktable mode suddenly those became greyish amd dark. That never happened to me. Now I would need to do plenty of changes. I thought it might be some issue with option “raw black/white point module” which was not picked by DT before, in my opinion. It is first thing that DT changes for RAW now, before it was not mentioned on the history panel at all. That cannot be switched off though. And apparently it ruins my old pictures that I processed even year ago. They were looking neat and I exported them to jpeg. Now they started to look terrible in DT. So it must be sth with DT or setup as it has an influence on all of my pics. Maybe I should tick off sth in DT?

This sound like the base curve resp your edit is not applied automatically. Maybe the sidecar files are not recognised. Btw: Greyish and dark is what the real raws actually look like.

I know that raw images are not impressing ones :slight_smile: but DT is always applying lots of modules so they are easy to curve in afterwards. And now it seems that sth happens with colours just straight from the beginning. On the history tab there is always each step mentioned starting from 0.original - which is grey and raw raw and then some steps done by app. Now I noticed that 1. Raw black/white appears and that was never shown before. That messes with my pics, they do not get better at any stage later on.